Re^2: about the spectrum

25 Sep 05 02:46, Maxim Timonin -> Danil Davydov:
DD>> What kind of HDD do you need? :)) If not IDE, then SCSI or
DD>>SATA remains? Do you have that kind of money?
MT> He meant MFM screws. There are also collectors of scrap metal...
I haven’t heard of such miracles, can you provide a brief summary?

With rules, Danil aka Merlin/ULG

Ay_Emul: VIBRATE

DD> I haven’t heard of such miracles, maybe you can provide a brief summary
DD>?

And I didn’t even see him. I just heard that there were such things before the advent of IDE.
And they even managed to build a (bulky) MFM controller for the spec, which, however
did not become widespread - IDE came and supplanted it for all the world. All. I
know nothing more about this.

Maksagor, NedoPC group. ATM-turbo 2+

In a message of 27 Sep 05 Maxim Timonin wrote to Danil Davydov:

MT> And I didn’t even see him. I just heard that there were such things before
MT> the advent of IDE. And they even managed to build a (bulky)
MT> MFM controller for the spec, which, however, did not become widespread - IDE
MT> came and supplanted it for nothing. All. I don’t know anything else about this.

Uh-huh, a certain Veremeenko wrote about the Ents in a zx-review. This controller, among other things, had a nice feature - it emulated a disk drive! That is, the same Spectrum with the same VG93 remained, and instead of a disk drive there was a controller. This idea, however, has its own right to life
(regardless of the screws).

Bye...

27 Sep 05 07:38, Vadik Akimoff -> Maxim Timonin:
VA> Uh-huh, someone Veremeenko wrote about ents in the zx-review. This controller,
VA>, among other things, had a nice feature - it emulated a disk drive! That is,
VA> remained the same Spectrum with the same VG93, and instead of a disk drive -
VA> this controller. This idea, however, has its own right to
VA> life (regardless of the screws).
And what was used as memory there? Also magnetic disks?

September, 27, 2033 06:38, I was digging in the trash of one research institute, and saw
a printout of a letter from Vadik Akimoff to Maxim Timonin:

VA> there was still the same Spectrum with the same VG93, and instead of a disk drive -

There is most likely not a VG93, but WD1003, or whatever its Soviet analogue is?

VA> this controller. This idea, however, has its own right to
VA> life (regardless of the screws).

And the screws too. ;-)))))

... RAW POTATOES OF NON-EXISTENCE, HAIR IN THE THROAT FOR A YEAR, TOILET PAPER

MT>> scrap metal...
DD> I haven’t heard of such miracles, can you provide a brief reference
DD>?

The main difference from the IDE is that it controls the drive
(it moves the heads, counts checksums and all that) the controller is external
(that’s why the MFM controller is a thing much more complex than IDE,
(on the ISA bus, IDE, in the simplest case, is just an address decoder
and a data buffer), data transfer from the HDD is carried out
via a serial differential channel, vaguely
reminiscent of ethernet or, rather, the FDD interface (although with ethernet
it most likely it was not lying nearby), the 34-wire cable for control signals and the 20-wire cable for data were made most likely for greater noise immunity (most of the wires are ground)
, in old laptops and desktop machines there are 3" options with one connector DP-26, on which both data, control, and power + 5
(including the motor), options with 2 cables are connected to the controller
like this: control cable - chain, data cables - "star" Interface
can work with more than 2 disks - at least with 4, but PC
controllers work, as a rule, with 2 (ISA modules), or with 1 (laptops
with a 26-pin cable, and most likely the Veremeenko controller for ZX, which was mentioned here - too, although I don’t know).

(n-Channel (dual orquad) ISA controllers, in which
HDDs have 2 disks at different addresses (170-177,1f0-1f7, ...) -
does not count ;))

There are terminators on the control buses, like on SCSI ;)

Options for logical disk layout (Interleave, SPT,...) can
be different, and is set by the controller, so when rearranging
a pre-formatted HDD to another control controller
there is a high probability of not even finding the sectors.

DVK-shny Zelenogradsky KZD - this is generally AKHTUNG - there delay lines
are made on resistors and capacitors! You yourself understand
what kind of confusion and vacillation of parameters there are in MLTs, and the screw is not even readable
by another similar controller ;)))

P.S. Kinta information on Veremeenko’s controller, or on
Veremeenko himself, if he is still alive. (going to a PC with Windows or in pursuit
of a long ruble equates to death - for me such a person is dead. Morally.)

*** [ YAVERTYUIOPCHESCH compaq ] /-------
... [ ASDFGHYKL;' . . . ]-----/

MT> build, which, however, did not become widespread - IDE came and
MT> supplanted it for nothing. All. I don't know anything else about it.

MFM is essentially an intermediate option between a 5.25 floppy drive and an IDE screw. That is, a
set of signal buses instead of a common bus in the IDE and control commands. Physically
it is very similar to a 5.25 floppy drive, two of the same cables, one with control lines and the other with data. The screw is as tall as 2 disk drives and weighs as much as a brick.

I think I have a Spekov MFM controller, but I haven’t tried to turn it on.

///
Roman Mindlin, MCP, MOS. ICQ UIN 8-=7=-5-=6=-5-=4=-4
...Interhelp BBS - Saint-Petersburg, RUSSIA.

VA>> Yeah, someone Veremeenko wrote about the entams in the zx-review. This controller,
VA>>, among other things, had a nice feature - it emulated a disk drive! That is,
VA>> there was still the same Spectrum with the same VG93, and instead of a disk drive -
VA>> this controller. This idea however has its own right to
VA>> life (regardless of the screws).

28 Sep 05 22:15, Roman Mindline -> Danil Davydov:
RM> MFM is essentially an intermediate option between a 5.25 drive and an IDE
RM> screw. Those. a set of signal buses instead of a common bus in the IDE and control commands
RM>. Physically, it is very similar to a 5.25 disk drive, two of the same
RM> cables, one with control lines and the other with data. The screw
RM> is as tall as 2 disk drives and weighs as much as a brick.
So this is also a screw, but with MFM control, a kind of multi-storey floppy disk? :)

DD>> disks?
VA> Flash cards, obviously. Those that have sd/mmc can work via SPI
VA> just right.
Did you get a simple ROM disk?

RM>> control commands. Physically it is very similar to a 5.25 disk drive, two
RM>> of the same cables, one has control lines, the other
RM>> has data. The screw is as tall as 2 disk drives and weighs as much as a brick.

DD> So this is also a screw, but with MFM control, a sort of multi-storey
DD> floppy disk? :)

MFM is actually a way of recording information, Modified Frequency
Modulation.

KD> P.S. Kinte information on the Veremeenko controller, or on
KD> Veremeenko himself, if he is still alive. (leaving to a PC with Windows or in pursuit
KD> for a long ruble is equivalent to death - for me such a person
KD> is dead. Morally.)

In this case, forget about Veremeenko immediately. For this guy not only blamed
PC, but, firstly, did it publicly and loudly (his article - “My choice -
PC!”, published in Paragraph N1, but this publication itself is a reprint
from somewhere else, but I forgot where), and secondly, he tried to openly and blatantly
take the entire ZX-party with him (see the same article).

KD> The main difference from IDE is that it controls the drive
KD> (it moves the heads, counts checksums and all that) the controller is external -
KD> (therefore the MFM controller is a much more complex thing than IDE,
KD> (on the ISA bus IDE, in the simplest case, it is just decoder
KD> addresses and data buffer),
Okay, tnx! Well, this thing definitely won’t work ;))

DD>> disks?

VA> Flash cards, obviously. Those that are sd/mmc can work via SPI
VA> just right.

FERRITE RINGS ;-))))))))))))))))))))))

... IN THE LAST AUTUMN!!! IN THE LAST AUTUMN!!! IN THE LAST AUTUMN!!! (c)

RM>>> control commands. Physically, it is very similar to a 5.25 disk drive, two
RM>>> of the same cables, one contains control lines, the other
RM>>> data. The screw is as tall as 2 disk drives and weighs as much as a brick.
DD>> So this is also a screw, but with MFM control, a kind of multi-storey
DD>> floppy disk? :)

September, 30, 2033 22:10 Roman Mindline Wrote to Danil Davydov :

RM> MFM is actually a way of recording information, Modified
RM> Frequency Modulation.

Yeah, and the interface has the ornate name ST506/412.

... border guard

DD> Sure, tnx! Well, such a thing definitely won’t work ;))

I can explain a little more precisely: the control there is really
very similar to the HDMD, only there is head selection from
0 to 7, and not 0-1 as on the FDD, there are also
four drive selection signals, like on the FDD, by the way. “Step back”, “step forward”
- we move the BMG, about the signals “Turn on the engine” and “Disc Cha-
nged” I’m not at all sure, the docks are not at hand, but they are most likely
just like a “stop” for a hare.

Data lines are separate from each drive - serial -
differential TTL channel, separate for reception and
transmission (i.e., only 4 wires, plus ground).

In the dock for control and data connectors, some contacts
are marked as .

... ["santeX/Film"] [LOOKING FOR A REFERENCE MANUAL LIGHT LIGHTS]

September, 29, 2033 10:44 Danil Davydov Wrote to Roman Mindline :

DD> So this is also a screw, but with MFM control, a kind of multi-storey
DD> floppy disk? :)

almost ;) 8 floors ;) - HS0-HS7 ;))))

... buttons instead of eyes-necrophilia-necrophilia-my exhausted necrophilia-

RM>>>> MFM is essentially an intermediate option between a 5.25 drive and
RM>>>> IDE screw. Those. a set of signal buses instead of a common bus in the IDE and
RM>>>> control commands. Physically, it is very similar to a 5.25 disk drive, two
RM>>>> of the same cables, one contains control lines, the other
RM>>>> data. The screw is as tall as 2 disk drives and weighs as much as a brick.
DD>>> So this is also a screw, but with MFM control, sort of

KD> It’s probably not VG93, but WD1003, or whatever its Soviet analogue is?

Read it syllable by syllable - INSTEAD OF A DISK DRIVE. What was there on this 'instead' - I have no
idea.

Bye...

DD>>> What was used as memory there? Also magnetic
DD>>> disks?
VA>> Flash cards, obviously. Those with sd/mmc can work via SPI
VA>> just right.

In a message of 30 Sep 05 Roman Mindline wrote to Danil Davydov:

RM> MFM is actually a way of recording information, Modified
RM> Frequency Modulation.

Well then, suggest an alternative name for mfm screws, you clever fellow. So that
everyone understands.

Bye...

VA> Well then, suggest an alternative name for mfm-screws, you are our smart guy.
VA> So that everyone understands.

Choose expressions. Otherwise I will suggest a name, but not to the screws.

PS: And read what is written more carefully, try to understand the meaning.

VA> Read syllable by syllable - INSTEAD OF A DISK DRIVE. What was there 'instead' of this one - I have no idea.

The board was connected to the disk drive cable. Switching images - by command,
commands were transmitted in serial code along one of the lines (like the one
drive D selects). Of course, compatibility with old software is complete. I don’t remember what the circuitry was like, I don’t remember, it was a long time ago. This controller was described in reviews.

WBR, Jason.

_/(ZX)/_ /*e-mail: jason2000 (not a cat)yandex.ru ICQ: 62235830*/

/np:/ *silence*

KD>> analogue?

VA> Read syllable by syllable - INSTEAD OF A DISK DRIVE. What was there on this 'instead' - I have no idea.

But in principle it is quite possible... ;) Only you can read and
write 2 surfaces, unless, of course, you do intelligent program control via the data channel, although the flop still has some
"input" signals that the screw does not need, and accordingly, their a person
could be used in an “inappropriate way”, for example, to select other
surfaces.
(How many physical surfaces the ST-225 has, I can’t tell you by heart now, you have to go into the doc. But you have to! ... at least I remember that there
there is one service surface on which user data not
stored...)

... I DEMAND CONTINUATION OF THE COLD WAR!