IS IT POSSIBLE TO DEVELOP A NEW SPECTRUM YOURSELF!

Hello, The Exploited if only I had more design skills, or at least a simulator what kind of processor for multisim I would develop such a miracle for free, i.e. diagram, and then look, the rest of the Kulibins would have connected and caught beetles, maybe someone put it on stream later. After all, earlier (revision and the development is not complicated by today's standards) was carried out with the enthusiasm of craftsmen! You can order the board at the factory for 1 thousand rubles without details ;) PS. Now you can draw all sorts of logic for the Z80 with your eyes closed, you'll get a computer (but who knows what... heh... here's the construction of the connecting logic is even interesting for professionals, how to solve crossford)

Hello, DDMZ DDM> I suggest you take this seriously! I would sell 10 tr. paid for the purchase DDM> such a miracle of technology =) would you give $10t for the development of such a miracle? well, I wouldn’t give it either, but that’s okay worth it. Conclusion: who will pay?

Hello, DDMZ too many "if onlys". Kulibins won’t be able to do this, but professionals work for big $$$. As for ordering the board - it’s not a problem at all, even to do it at home, and this task is far from paramount

Hello Ronin I want to return your attention to the very beginning of the topic, and remember about the z380. So, according to the specification, this percent is compatible with z80 commands! those. you can develop a board for this processor, and if successful circumstances, some programs for the Spectrum will run on it, but programs already written for the z380 will not start. Even now you can pay attention to the larger size of the address bus... The percentage is similar, so I don’t see anything complicated! The simplest thing is possible modify the current platform to use the new processor. Isn't it? I suggest you take this seriously! I would sell 10 tr. I paid for the purchase of such a miracle technology =) You can easily attach PCI/ISA or even AGP to it =) You can see its similarity to the 80386, is it possible to solder a z380 into the motherboard? (I don't have the spec for 386)

Hello, spectrum For DDMZ :) Options for developing “new ZX hardware”: (Revision 0.1) 1) PC emulator (miniPC of different types) for the ZX case Everything is clear here, no comments 2) Development of a ZX emulator computer (modern processor) Probably as a by-product of development for other purposes. Otherwise, it’s more profitable than point 1 3) "Pocket ZX" Radical minimization of hardware and consumption. Smoothly transitions into the topic of "PDA development" and emulation... 4) New implementation based on logic (“clone”) Is it interesting as "retro engineering"? 5) Development of devices for existing “clones”

Hello, spectrum The modernization of Leningrad-1 gradually flowed into step 4 for me :)

Hello ASDT I FOUND INFO ON THE INTERNET TODAY! And I posted all the documents here: http://gssoft.front.ru/files/progz/z80+z380.zip Here we talk about how to quickly and easily install Z380 instead of Z80! Only processor replacement! At the same time, the full potential of the Z380 is not revealed but the Kulibins here will be able to reveal their potential based on the ready-made old platform. I feel the Sprinter is already resting =) Where can I buy the Z380? I think I'll have to go to the radio this weekend market...

Hello hero 2 hero >Only one problem remains, the processor will not work in the Spectrum. That is how is this? What is the reason? Once there is a belief, there must be a justification. I looked and compared, everything seemed logical, I read the description carefully, that remain by the legs, etc.

Hello, DDMZ 1. Many undocumented commands will not work 2. Many teams (undocumented became documented) 3. Commands like ld b,b ld c,c now have meaning that the software will handle 4. Ports 00-FF are used inside the processor and go outside 5. I may be wrong, but I didn’t notice anything written anywhere in the doc that it can work with Z80 bus mode

Hello hero her> 3. Commands like ld b,b ld c,c now have the meaning that will her> settle software I ran it in the Z380, they are the same as in the Z80 And they also gave me several examples in Angoitsk that the joystick is official it sits not on DF but on 1F (although this is crooked)

Hello hero her> And they also gave me several examples in Angoitsky of what a joystick is her> officially sits not on DF but on 1F (although this is crooked) On DF only in some Spanish toys, as far as I remember...

Hello Lethargeek Let> On DF only in some Spanish toys, as far as I remember... so let's go through it all again: 1. Many undocumented commands will not work Nothing like that! all teams are in place! 2. Many teams (undocumented became documented) I don't see anything bad. 3. Commands like ld b,b ld c,c now have meaning that the software will handle Nothing like that! I ran your comments in the Z380, they are the same as in the Z80 4. Ports 00-FF are used inside the processor and go outside I read the entire specification up and down! I haven't found anything like this! There are internal processor ports for which commands are used in0 and out0 ! their 0-FF ports do not go outside in the description; they are on-chip! and for commands in and out ports 0-ff go outside! 5. I may be wrong, but I didn’t notice anything written anywhere in the doc that it can work with Z80 bus mode Written at the very beginning Enhanced Instruction Set that Maintains Object-Code o Compatibility with Z80 and Z180 Microprocessors 16-Bit (64K) or 32-Bit (4G) Linear Address Space 16-Bit Data Bus with Dynamic Sizing (can work as 8-bit) This is also mentioned in z80+z380.doc from the archive. And it says how to turn it on. The processor responds perfectly to wait, the regeneration time can be controlled (and turn off)! And in general, the processor is fully compatible with the Z80!As a result, heroy, refutations were found for all statements of incompatibility! As a result, I see absolutely nothing that prevents me from using this processor instead of the Z80, especially following the instructions for installing it! Moreover, you can install 2 processors! one z80 and the second Z380! and switch them through some port! although this is not desired! All you need is the Z380, which is fully capable of replacing the Z80! At the same time old The software won't even notice this, even TR-DOS will work! other The fact is that the percent can work 15 times faster! Prots Z380 verified by the author! for performance instead of Z80, on normal Spectrum by simply replacing the processor ( http://gssoft.front.ru/files/progz/z80+z380.zip)! I see no more reason distrust! It's time for the Spectrum platform to step forward! Let's hope that ATM Turbo 3 will precisely use the Z380 (there is a mention of modules memory instead of microcircuits)!

Hello, spectrum So he can take a modern MK and emulate... Why Z380...

Hello spensor spe> Yes, there are commands in0 and out0, but they were introduced in Z180 and only for the sake of spe> convenience (which only engineers from Zilog know), but what is the appeal spe> to port #00FE via commands like IN (C),B and new ones will lead to spe> accessing the same port is certain. Not for sure, but that’s exactly what it is.

Hello ASDT DDM> 4. Ports 00-FF are used inside the processor and go outside DDM> I re-read the entire specification up and down! I didn’t find anything like that! DDM> There are internal processor ports for which they are used DDM> commands in0 and out0 ! their 0-FF ports do not go outside in the description DDM> they are on-chip! and for in and out commands, ports 0-ff go outside! Yes, there are in0 and out0 commands, but they were introduced in the Z180 and only for the sake of convenience (which only the engineers from Zilog know), but the fact that access to port #00FE through commands like IN (C), B and new ones will lead to access to the same port for sure. There is an indication of this in the datasheet and on the forum already discussion on this point. PS; A; about the fact that the author used the Z380 live, this is a fairy tale - what is written in The attached document is simply a free essay by a “dreamer.” The MSX Z380 had used, but not as the main percentage, but as a support and all for the same reason - in the processor now has internal ports with which native software does not work there will be.

Hello Ronin And as for the fact that the author used the Z380 live, this is a fairy tale Well, maybe the launch happened. Only now, based on conversations about ports, I think Apparently I couldn’t use existing programs, in particular TR-DOS. because ports 0-ff are practically not used at startup (especially in 48k) and you can safely work. But all the same, if you need full compatibility! (without converting the owl to a new one percent) then I suggest using 2 processors switched on top of each other directly, and first the Z80 is launched, then let’s say we send it to a certain port 1 and Z80 Z380 turns off and on! (and vice versa) As for TR-DOS and working with a tape recorder... I doubt that they will exist at all are in demand when using the Z380 because there is a lot of memory! you can use FAT and mark bad blocks! And there, under the emulator, work with your TR-DOS via the FDD controller. Kempston Port? I doubt that he will survive at all on the new processor in it either there will be no need, because You can use multicards, at least Kempston can be transplanted to a new port. Who is on the spktrum and has so many non-standard things, 1 did it, the other did it too in its own way, and 20 different modifications of the same thing! Sovte succeeds hold a maximum of 10 modifications. If you use the Z380, then we will have access to PC equipment and the ports will be at least standardized. And you can buy used Isa boards everywhere for almost pennies... maximum RUR 100! It's time to donate!Let's remember 8086 and the transition to 80386. Complete inoperability of 50% of the software about which No one even bothered to remember. Other screws, new controllers... new ports, ISA 16, tons of memory... Wasn't it worth it? to the same port for sure. Not for sure, but that’s exactly what it is. Show evidence. Somehow I doubt it. I can't find any mention of this in datasheet. The Z380 is built in the image and likeness of the 80386, it also has internal ports like on-chip and work in a similar way, and regular commands like out go beyond Process limits range from 0!

Hello, DDMZ DDM> If you use the Z380, we will have access to PC equipment and there will be ports at least DDM> are standardized. Yes, and you can buy used Isa boards everywhere for almost DDM> kopecks... maximum 100 rubles! Isn’t it easier to buy a used PC and have the same thing without the hemorrhoids.

Hello, CHRV Yes, this 380 was a success. for that matter, there are more advanced processors Zilog - welcome to www.zilog.com

Hello, DDMZ DDM> Here we talk about how quickly and easily without modifying the platform DDM> plug in Z380 instead of Z80! Only processor replacement! At the same time, unopened DDM> the full potential of the Z380, but the Kulibins will be able to reveal it to anyone here DDM> potential based on a ready-made old platform. I smell Sprinter already DDM> resting =) If it were possible to replace the Z80 with a Z380 or at least with a simple plug-in Z180, then we would have lived under communism long ago. These are the hot heads with with optimism they take on what they themselves do not understand and take the writings on faith storytellers. You are not the first to consider yourself Archimedes. DDM> If you read carefully, you can find that the percentage DDM> supporting memory sticks, and all mikruhi like ru in the future DDM> can be thrown out after modifications. DDM> And also 16bit Isa in future improvements, this is very cool! it will be possible DDM> use SVGA and VGA cards!! :D :D :D DDM> Yes... this is very cool =) The state of euphoria is a temporary phenomenon, then withdrawal occurs. DDM> I looked and compared, everything seemed logical, I read the description carefully,DDM> about what kind of legs remain, etc. Read not only the Russian-language text, but also the datasheets on the Z380, and at the same time it won’t hurt read about the Z180 as it is an intermediate model between the Z80 and Z380. And the Russian-speaking author is far from an authoritative source - if only he I held the Z380 chip in my hands, not to mention testing the chip in operation, the document would have been completely different - that’s not how practitioners write! DDM> 1. Many undocumented commands will not work DDM> Nothing like that! all teams are in place! Just for your sake, I am providing a list of undocumented Z80 commands that are not in Z380 or performing completely different actions: ┌─- CODE ─── Code Command Z80 Command Z380 ED 30 *IN F, (N) IN0, (N) ED 31 *OUT (N), F - ED 4E *IM0 IM3 ED 54 *NEG NEGW ED 55 *RETN RETB ED 5C *NEG MLT DE ED 5D *RETI - ED 64 *NEG TST m ED 65 *RETN EXTS ED 66 *IM0 - ED 6C *NEG MLT HL ED 6D *RETI - ED 6E *IM0 - ED 70 IN F, (N) - ED 71 *OUT (N), F OUT (C), N ED 74 *NEG TSTIO (N) ED 75 *RETN EXTSW ED 76 *IM1 SLP ED 7C *NEG MLT SP ED 7D *RETI - ED 7E *IM2 - └── CODE ─── In addition: U-F does not just mean the absence of a team (that is, as much as possible assume NOP in Z80), and TRAP interrupt!DDM> 2. Many commands (undocumented became documented) DDM> I don’t see anything bad. See above. In addition, I will add that the undocumented eight SLI commands (codes #CB #30 - #CB #37) in both the Z180 and Z380 the central percentages no longer work at detection of such codes results in a TRAP interrupt (something between NMI and RESET). And the fact that there are undocumented commands in every second program on Spectrum, you can be sure that every programmer likes to show off and use such a command. DDM> 3. Commands like ld b,b ld c,c now have the meaning that will be DDM> resolve software DDM> Nothing like that! DDM> Your comments I ran in the Z380 they are the same as in the Z80 Yes, Heroy made a mistake here C team LD B,B; LD C,C; LD D,D; LD E,E get a new one meaning (suffixes .SIS, .LIS, .SIL, .LIL, respectively) only in the processor eZ80. In Z180, Z380 they are simply NOP. The remaining commands are LD L,L; LD H,H continue to perform the role of NOP, but in order to avoid Troubles, do not use them recommended. By the way, the HALT command in this reading would be the LD command (HL),(HL). DDM> 4. Ports 00-FF are used inside the processor and go outsideDDM> I re-read the entire specification up and down! I didn’t find anything like that! DDM> There are internal processor ports for which they are used DDM> commands in0 and out0 ! their 0-FF ports do not go outside in the description DDM> they are on-chip! and for in and out commands, ports 0-ff go outside! The IN0 and OUT0 commands are essentially analogues of the IN A,(N) and OUT(N),A commands inherited from the i8080 C, frankly speaking, IMHO, they are still crap. Actions executed by these commands: ┌─- CODE ─── IN A,(N) IN A, (port), where port=portH+portL, portH(A15-A8)=A, portL(A7-A0)=N OUT(N),A OUT(port), A, where port=portH+portL, portH(A15-A8)=A, portL(A7-A0)=N IN0 IN reg, (port), where port=portH+portL, portH(A15-A8)=0, portL(A7-A0)=N OUT0 OUT(port), reg, where port=portH+portL, portH(A15-A8)=0, portL(A7-A0)=N └── CODE ─── For Z180, execution of the IN0 and OUT0 commands is completely equivalent to IN A,(N) and OUT(N),A with pre-zeroed battery. For Z380 the situation is more interesting: (quote from datasheet) ┌─- CODE ─── The Z380 CPU has the on-chip I/O address space to control on-chip peripheral functions of the Superintegration version of the devices. A portion of it interrupt functions are also controlled by several on-chip registers, whichoccupy an on-chip I/O address space. This on-chip I/O address space can be accessed only with the following reserved on-chip I/O instructions which are identical to the Z180 original I/O instructions to access Page 0 I/O addressing area. IN0 R,(n) OTIM IN0(n)OTIMR OUT0 (n),R OTDM TSTIO n OTDMR When one of these I/O instructions is executed, the Z380 MPU outputs the register address being accessed in a pseudo-transaction of two BUSCLK cycles duration, with the address signals A31-A8 at zero. In the pseudo-trans-actions, all bus control signals are at their inactive state. └── CODE ─── That is, it seems that when using these commands there is a the port address, as it should be, but the control strobe (in the case of the Z80 this is IORQ) no. In principle, this does not mean anything because this option is more correct compared to the performance of the Z180. Find a direct indication of the behavior of the IN A,(N) and OUT(N),A commands with preliminary zeroed accumulator, as well as commands IN reg, (C) OUT (C), reg, with I was unable to pre-zero the reg register, so please forgive me There are no compelling arguments yet. But with a high degree of probability it can be said that that OUT to zero registers/ports will load internal registers, similarly for IN from zero registers, we will get the contents of the internal register. Such problems can only be resolved by practice, so the Soldering Ironin the teeth and forward. DDM> 5. I may be wrong, but I didn’t notice anything anywhere in the dock DDM> it is written that it can work with the Z80 bus mode Where did you see the indication that the Z380 is capable of a 16-bit external data bus? switch to 8-bit, and moreover, it is the default (at the moment of switching on) does it work like 8-bit? The phrase U16-Bit Data Bus with Dynamic Sizing F is quite perhaps it means something completely different from what you thought, for example it could be about internal data bus. In any case, the document itself says nothing of the sort. it says. PS; AND; finally the last argument Ts Zilog removed these chips 2-3 years ago from production. Getting it right now is a small problem, but not a single engineer will such equipment should be included in new developments, so you can talk about ATM3 forget.

Hello Ronin Ron> yes, this 380 was given. for that matter, there are more advanced ones Ron> processors from Zilog - welcome to www.zilog.com I can recommend visiting http://www.zilog.ru/

Hello, DDMZ DDM> No means exactly what I thought yeah, only with an 8-bit bus it becomes ordinary 4-cycle machine cycles, and this at a frequency of 18 MHz does not awaken any emotions at all - it’s simpler put the usual z80-20MHz!!! But again, I repeat, there are more modern processors of the EZ80 line, with a conveyor and a bunch of embarrassments.

Hello spensor Z380 in the image and likeness of 80386 somehow does not awaken warm feelings, old software is like an umbrella for a fish, but for the new there are better options (like ARM9%)), All that remains is to overcome religious prejudices ;) By the way, such a thing as the GBA (on ARMe) had the insides of a GameBoy (on the Z80) for compatibility with it, but ultimately due to the characteristics of the ones used cartridges, a GameBoy emulator for GBA (ARM) was created :D I will not develop it further because it has already been discussed (with zero results).

Hello spensor spe> Where did you see the indication that the Z380 is capable of 16-bit external spe> switch the data bus to 8-bit, and moreover, it is the default Does spe> (when enabled) work as 8-bit? Phrase U16-Bit Data Bus spe> with Dynamic Sizing F quite possibly means something completely different from what you mean spe> I thought, for example, we could be talking about an internal data bus. No means exactly what I thought ;) D15-D0 Data Bus (input/outputs, active High, tri-state). This bi-directional 16-bit data bus is used for data transfer between the Z380 MPU and memory or I/O devices. Note that for a memory word transfer, the even-addressed (A0 = 0) byte is generally transferred on D15-D8, and the odd-addressed (A0 = 1) byte on D7-D0 (see the /MSIZE pin description). /MSIZE Memory Size (input, active Low). This input, from the addressed memory location, indicates if it is word size (logic High) or byte size (logic Low). In the latter case, the addressed memory should be connected to the D15-D8 portion of the data bus, and an additional memory transac- tion will automatically be generated to complete a word size data transfer.

Hello, *Felix* can the EZ80 address more than 64k?

Hello hero What's the problem then? =) let's use EZ80 in new Spectrums?) Give me a link to the datasheet

Hello, spectrum >> can the EZ80 address more than 64k? 16 MB

Hello, spectrum The problems are the same, plus commands like Ld b,b are used as prefixes. In short what To run software on this process, you need to write an OS with a virtual machine Its 50 MHz is hardly enough. And the link is Zilog.com

Hello hero her> let's use EZ80 in new Spectrums?) use it :) I mean we are waiting for a new Spectrum from you (I'm serious). take it, study.

Hello, spectrum The quote has the wrong author :)

Hello hero her> The quote has the wrong author Well, like, this is related to that author. It's just a glitch in the forum :)